good car audio shops - becoming a thing of the past?

[Ahmed Johnson]

Op, when you go shopping, do you pick the mom and pop store's for groceries or do you go to big retailer? To be honest, this post to me is about some dude crying because his consumer got smart enough to realize that paying a dealer 100 above cost is absolutely idiotic. I mean, I have a couple good shops I go to in Chicago, that do charge more for equipment than what I can get online, but they also encourage you to buy the equipment yourself and will charge you for the install and not give two shits who sold the consumer the equipment.

 

[3kgtAudio 10+ year member]

Yes. You have demonstrated this several times in your posts.... "a. A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people." If everyone is allowed the same equally shared pricing, the only people making a profit is the government (taxes) and the manufacture is left with 5%.

Maybe socialist would be a better fit?

LOL, i dang near fell off my chair, good one!

 

[3kgtAudio 10+ year member]

Op, when you go shopping, do you pick the mom and pop store's for groceries or do you go to big retailer? To be honest, this post to me is about some dude crying because his consumer got smart enough to realize that paying a dealer 100 above cost is absolutely idiotic. I mean, I have a couple good shops I go to in Chicago, that do charge more for equipment than what I can get online, but they also encourage you to buy the equipment yourself and will charge you for the install and not give two shits who sold the consumer the equipment.

I wouldn't call it 'got smart', I just call it 'no longer seeing the value of professional dealer'. And no matter what the markup is, the 'consumer' shouldn't even know what cost is in the first place. People want too much for too little, thats all. Cant exactly expect good shops to hang around when its like that, but im sure all the same people will be crying about how all the shops ****, and leave them with a half - a s s install.

btw, by comparsion to your analogy, we are less than the big box stores, who would represent the 'big grocery store'. You are not going to find 'dealer pricing' at your grocery store lol, that would be a 'farmers market'. Which is more or less who we would be in the picture. Is it idiotic that your paying that grocery store 800% markup?

btw we do charge more for installs when people go online and make sure they know that if they have warranty issues, the also will be charged for removal and reinstall too.

Bottom line is, if I need to de-value myself and work for pennies just to do car audio, its not worth it. 20+ years of pro experience counts for something, and has value, and we charge for it. For you to hire me to do your install, it has to cost a certain amount, period. Im not an 18 year old kid straight out of high school who just knows how to do basic stuff, and is worth $10 per hr. Whether or not you want that over the 'cheapest' thing you can find is a personal choice, it is your car after all, just don't complain about the end result if you go the lowest cost route.

 

[3kgtAudio 10+ year member]

It doesn't seem like your prices are too far out of hand. We have a few audio places in Tulsa that have different levels of installs for 369, 569, 769, etc. That seems to the trend now. At 369 you get a couple QPower 12's or Kenwood 12's, a prefab box, an SSL 3000 watt powerhouse (LOL), and a Kenwood or Pio HU with AUX and USB all installed. That's cheap! And yeah it's all garbage but to a 17 year old kid that just wants noise this will do the trick. Problem is you see people with Escalades and Audi's in there! They've spent 60k on a car and got a garbage install and garbage equipment. I don't get it... I buy my own equipment myself and install it and buy my boxes from pro-rabbit (he's local and does GREAT work). If I couldn't install my own stuff my option is these places or Car Toys that will absolutely rip me off on equipment and install. What's the consumer supposed to do?

And that same customer that paid $369 installed for their system in their $60k car probably brings it back 10 times complaining about how its not 'top notch'

I personally hate cheap product, it breaks, it creates more work in the long run, and I just won't sell it. I spent enough time warrantying out cheap flip down screens and decks. You sometimes do the labor 3 times just because its cheaply built

 

[Beatin' 10+ year member]

Yes. You have demonstrated this several times in your posts.... "a. A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people." If everyone is allowed the same equally shared pricing, the only people making a profit is the government (taxes) and the manufacture is left with 5%.

Maybe socialist would be a better fit?

This argument makes no sense. Ain't nothing equally shared.

If the manufacturer wants to by-pass the distributor and dealers and sell straight to me at a lower cost so they can move more product, that's between me and the manufacturer. Everybody else can keep crying for all I care. Straight Capitalism, through and through.

You and OP are upset for one reason and one reason only...........the manufacturers have found a way to make money without dealers in the picture. Cutting out the middle men means less cost for the consumer and more product movement for the manufacturer.

That's a BIG DEAL. If I opened up a car audio business today, it would revolve around getting buildhouse products from overseas and selling them through an online website while advertising on audio forums. That's the status quo today because it works. What would I need dealers for?

 

[d77543020 10+ year member]

This argument makes no sense. Ain't nothing equally shared.
If the manufacturer wants to by-pass the distributor and dealers and sell straight to me at a lower cost so they can move more product' date=' that's between me and the manufacturer. Everybody else can keep crying for all I care. Straight Capitalism, through and through.

You and OP are upset for one reason and one reason only...........the manufacturers have found a way to make money without dealers in the picture. Cutting out the middle men means less cost for the consumer and more product movement for the manufacturer.

That's a BIG DEAL. If I opened up a car audio business today, it would revolve around getting buildhouse products from overseas and selling them through an online website while advertising on audio forums. That's the status quo today because it works. What would I need dealers for?[/quote']i completley agree sonic,3king audio and other online retailers would not exist if manufacturers were not flooding there product to the gray market to make more money, and we consumers are just taking advantage of it,i do believe that shops will make a comeback as cars are getting harder to work on,the one big thing that shops always bring up is warrenty but if you deal with a good online company like sonic you will not have a issue

 

[Ahmed Johnson]

I wouldn't call it 'got smart', I just call it 'no longer seeing the value of professional dealer'. And no matter what the markup is, the 'consumer' shouldn't even know what cost is in the first place. People want too much for too little, thats all. Cant exactly expect good shops to hang around when its like that, but im sure all the same people will be crying about how all the shops ****, and leave them with a half - a s s install.
btw, by comparsion to your analogy, we are less than the big box stores, who would represent the 'big grocery store'. You are not going to find 'dealer pricing' at your grocery store lol, that would be a 'farmers market'. Which is more or less who we would be in the picture. Is it idiotic that your paying that grocery store 800% markup?

btw we do charge more for installs when people go online and make sure they know that if they have warranty issues, the also will be charged for removal and reinstall too.

Bottom line is, if I need to de-value myself and work for pennies just to do car audio, its not worth it. 20+ years of pro experience counts for something, and has value, and we charge for it. For you to hire me to do your install, it has to cost a certain amount, period. Im not an 18 year old kid straight out of high school who just knows how to do basic stuff, and is worth $10 per hr. Whether or not you want that over the 'cheapest' thing you can find is a personal choice, it is your car after all, just don't complain about the end result if you go the lowest cost route.

No, you aren't considered the big box store in my analogy. You are the mom and pop's store in my analogy.

 

[d77543020 10+ year member]

No, you aren't considered the big box store in my analogy. You are the mom and pop's store in my analogy.

and with any mom and pop store the prices are higher so they have to rely on customer service and thats cool but when a good percentage of your customer base does there own work(installs)it becomes harder to justify your higher prices

 

[3kgtAudio 10+ year member]

This argument makes no sense. Ain't nothing equally shared.
If the manufacturer wants to by-pass the distributor and dealers and sell straight to me at a lower cost so they can move more product' date=' that's between me and the manufacturer. Everybody else can keep crying for all I care. Straight Capitalism, through and through.

You and OP are upset for one reason and one reason only...........the manufacturers have found a way to make money without dealers in the picture. Cutting out the middle men means less cost for the consumer and more product movement for the manufacturer.

That's a BIG DEAL. If I opened up a car audio business today, it would revolve around getting buildhouse products from overseas and selling them through an online website while advertising on audio forums. That's the status quo today because it works. What would I need dealers for?[/quote']

Its actually NOT the manufacturers 'figuring out a way' to make money, they wouldn't intentionally cut dealers out of the picture. You really think you know anything about the inside workings of this business? Your just some kid behind a keyboard with an opinion.

Also, YOU wouldn't make any money. Do you have millions in capital to stock a massive warehouse and staff it? That's what it takes to make money by that idea.

YOU need a dealer, im sure you think your smart wiring up a simple amp in your Civic, let me see you install an alarm / remote start in any moderately complicated car, or how about when you drill a hole through a firewall and hit a critical component causing thousands in damage

, and when you fry the ECU or BCM, then you realize why DEALERS exist, all too late, because you thought saving a buck was more important.

Im not saying this to insult you, I have seen many many people over the years cut corners to save money, trying it themselves, thought they could google information and become a pro overnight, and wind up spending way more than they would have in the long run if they just brought it to a pro in the first place.

 

[3kgtAudio 10+ year member]

No, you aren't considered the big box store in my analogy. You are the mom and pop's store in my analogy.

Mom and Pop store has a better advantage of low overhead, big box store has buying power but massive overhead, in the real world the mom and pop store has the advantage, as well as more knowledgeable staff and a better more personable relationship.

Your analogy would be as if the farms sold direct to the public, which they can't, they recognize they need stores aka 'dealers' to move their product for them.

This model when it comes to electronics is just all 'grey' markets people, its not the manufcturers being so called 'smart' by selling directly to you. Call up Pioneer or JL audio when your product fails outside of any online sellers 30 day or so guarantee, and see how far you get when you try to warranty out your stuff. You will be paying for it.

 

[3kgtAudio 10+ year member]

and with any mom and pop store the prices are higher so they have to rely on customer service and thats cool but when a good percentage of your customer base does there own work(installs)it becomes harder to justify your higher prices

Your giving the customer base too much credit, your average Joe cannot handle car audio installs, some either realize they can't and don't, others think they can and screw it up, very few actually know how to do it right. The attitude that its easy and should be cheap is really dumb. If something takes us 2 hrs, you really think we should only make $40 on it?

Also, your not going to hire a pro to just do it for a minimum wage price. Try doing that with a mechanic..

What I hear is people just being 'mad' because a business is actually trying to make a profit. Totally absurd lol.

 

[d77543020 10+ year member]

Your giving the customer base too much credit, your average Joe cannot handle car audio installs, some either realize they can't and don't, others think they can and screw it up, very few actually know how to do it right. The attitude that its easy and should be cheap is really dumb. If something takes us 2 hrs, you really think we should only make $40 on it?
Also, your not going to hire a pro to just do it for a minimum wage price. Try doing that with a mechanic..

What I hear is people just being 'mad' because a business is actually trying to make a profit. Totally absurd lol.

your right but but most of us only do basic installs a deck here a amp there,its a guy on youtube that has hundreds of videos just showing people step by step on how to install decks in various diffrent cars but i do agree with you if you need custom work or a alarm im at a shop

 

[Ahmed Johnson]

and with any mom and pop store the prices are higher so they have to rely on customer service and thats cool but when a good percentage of your customer base does there own work(installs)it becomes harder to justify your higher prices

Agreed.

 

[Ahmed Johnson]

Mom and Pop store has a better advantage of low overhead, big box store has buying power but massive overhead, in the real world the mom and pop store has the advantage, as well as more knowledgeable staff and a better more personable relationship.
Your analogy would be as if the farms sold direct to the public, which they can't, they recognize they need stores aka 'dealers' to move their product for them.

This model when it comes to electronics is just all 'grey' markets people, its not the manufcturers being so called 'smart' by selling directly to you. Call up Pioneer or JL audio when your product fails outside of any online sellers 30 day or so guarantee, and see how far you get when you try to warranty out your stuff. You will be paying for it.

Well in car audio, you don't need brick and mortar stores when you can buy at an online store. If I decided to drive to a farm, you don't think the farmer would sell eggs and milk directly to me? I hate to say it, but everyone in everyway will figure a way to cut out the middle man. I find it stupid to pay someone a percent of anything when I can get it myself cheaper. I don't think your beef is with the customers.

 

[kramer_212 10+ year member]

Well in car audio, you don't need brick and mortar stores when you can buy at an online store. If I decided to drive to a farm, you don't think the farmer would sell eggs and milk directly to me? I hate to say it, but everyone in everyway will figure a way to cut out the middle man. I find it stupid to pay someone a percent of anything when I can get it myself cheaper. I don't think your beef is with the customers.

most people cant install, don't forget that.