midbass imaging?

[Chaotic_Thought 10+ year member]

I have some unknown model CDT comps in the doors of my 03 F150 ext cab. When sitting in a normal driving position, the midbass response is rather lackluster. However if i move my head more towards where the head unit sits in the dash, the midbass response improves dramatically. Now i know i am moving more on axis to the drivers, and that the doors are not deadened, but what can be done to move the midbass focus higher in the cab?

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[mylows10 5,000+ posts]

deaden the doors or make pods ,i run cdt also and mine sound nice

 

[Chaotic_Thought 10+ year member]

deaden the doors or make pods ,i run cdt also and mine sound nice

Though i appreciate the input, you didn't really answer the question put forward. I acknowledged that the doors are not deadened and asked if there was an alternative to move the focus up.

 

[CHEMMINS 10+ year member]

He gave you both answers you needed. Either deaden the doors or reposition them with pods.

 

[Chaotic_Thought 10+ year member]

He gave you both answers you needed. Either deaden the doors or reposition them with pods.

So basically those 2 are the only conceivable options?

 

[mylows10 5,000+ posts]

well you could make mounting rings for them and just make one side of the rings wider than the other to point them in the direction you want

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

I have some unknown model CDT comps in the doors of my 03 F150 ext cab. When sitting in a normal driving position, the midbass response is rather lackluster. However if i move my head more towards where the head unit sits in the dash, the midbass response improves dramatically. Now i know i am moving more on axis to the drivers, and that the doors are not deadened, but what can be done to move the midbass focus higher in the cab?

So, basically what you are saying is that the midbass is weak in one position and stronger when you move around....AND you want a higher stage?

Firstly, with the midbass, what youre experiencing is cancellation from phasing issues. To be sure, fade all of the sound to one side on your HU and if the midbass is better than with the 2, its cancellation. If you have Time Alignment on your HU, this will help. But if you do not, swap the pos and neg (phase) on one of the drivers and see if it improves, if not, swap it back and try the other.

 

[Chaotic_Thought 10+ year member]

So, basically what you are saying is that the midbass is weak in one position and stronger when you move around....AND you want a higher stage?
Firstly, with the midbass, what youre experiencing is cancellation from phasing issues. To be sure, fade all of the sound to one side on your HU and if the midbass is better than with the 2, its cancellation. If you have Time Alignment on your HU, this will help. But if you do not, swap the pos and neg (phase) on one of the drivers and see if it improves, if not, swap it back and try the other.

Ahh yes. I have faded from side to side, but still with the same effect. I am running the 880 and have tried all sorts of T/A and crossover combinations and nothing really seems to help. With it faded to either side, I am still getting poor midbass at normal driving position but the on axis response is much better. I know that the stock location is far from optimal, but i though midbass wasn't as directional and didn't need to be mounted on axis.

What are the chances that it is the cheaper CDT's that are causing the issue?

 

[Rich B 5,000+ posts]

well you could make mounting rings for them and just make one side of the rings wider than the other to point them in the direction you want

Like this......

Angled MDF speaker ring pair, 6.5" NEW | eBay

 

[TaylorFade 10+ year member]

Where do you have them crossed? And how much power are you giving them? You don't get "height" from midbass. Width, maybe. Height is waaaay out of MB range.

If it sounds better when you move your head to the center, I don't see why T/A wouldn't help that. Maybe you need to revisit your settings. But definitely try reversing the polarity too.

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

Ahh yes. I have faded from side to side, but still with the same effect. I am running the 880 and have tried all sorts of T/A and crossover combinations and nothing really seems to help. With it faded to either side, I am still getting poor midbass at normal driving position but the on axis response is much better. I know that the stock location is far from optimal, but i though midbass wasn't as directional and didn't need to be mounted on axis.
What are the chances that it is the cheaper CDT's that are causing the issue?

Well, midbass is localized by arrival time at your ears so, with proper T/A and install, I would think most any location could work. Aiming is important but not as much as a tweeter or so IMO.

Anywhoo, the main thing that makes me think cancellation is that you said it improves dramatically if you move your head to the center of the car. Whether or not the drivers are on axis or not wont affect the volume of the midbass freqs. In the higher freqs were beaming occurs is where on/off axis becomes a problem usually. You say youve tried playing with the T/A, though. You could still try flipping the phase on one driver, but, I'm not even too sure that would fix it but its free to try.

Do you run a sub? or rear speakers?

 

[Chaotic_Thought 10+ year member]

Where do you have them crossed? And how much power are you giving them? You don't get "height" from midbass. Width, maybe. Height is waaaay out of MB range.
If it sounds better when you move your head to the center, I don't see why T/A wouldn't help that. Maybe you need to revisit your settings. But definitely try reversing the polarity too.

Well sadly the whole setup so far has been a bit of a hassle. And the thread i had started on the subject has vanished.

Basically with all head unit settings being flat and balanced, no TA, one side will bottom out before the other. I have tried swapping channels, changed RCA's, among other things and can't solve the issue. I am starting to think the preouts on my 880 are bad. I need to put a DMM to the preouts to see if they are varying from the other.

Well, midbass is localized by arrival time at your ears so, with proper T/A and install, I would think most any location could work. Aiming is important but not as much as a tweeter or so IMO.
Anywhoo, the main thing that makes me think cancellation is that you said it improves dramatically if you move your head to the center of the car. Whether or not the drivers are on axis or not wont affect the volume of the midbass freqs. In the higher freqs were beaming occurs is where on/off axis becomes a problem usually. You say youve tried playing with the T/A, though. You could still try flipping the phase on one driver, but, I'm not even too sure that would fix it but its free to try.

Do you run a sub? or rear speakers?

No sub as of yet. I am in the process of building a center console to house a Dcon powered by most likely a Skar 800.1. I have the rears defeated by the head unit. With the rears playing i was getting very obvious cancellation. As in if i moved the fade from full forward to 0 what bass i had would start to disappear all together.

 

[TaylorFade 10+ year member]

Maybe one is blown?

 

[mylows10 5,000+ posts]

Maybe one is blown?

if so ,i have some replacements for you .$$$$

 

[Chaotic_Thought 10+ year member]

Maybe one is blown?

Unlikely. Swapping outputs from the head unit will swap the side that pops. I just need to track down if it is the amp causing the problem or the head unit. The amp is a cheap crunch 5000.1

if so ,i have some replacements for you .$$$$

Hah my wife still is unhappy that i dropped $125 on 1/0 out of the blue.